Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Technical stuff specific to the Raptor 1000
JakesS
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Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by JakesS »

Ok so my Raptor is no longer running as the TPS is Farked! :angry:

But now I am thinking I can get a better deal on a TL 1000 R Intake system this includes the throttle bodies, sensors, and the injectors. Now I know there is a difference between the two intakes systems. But what did Cagiva change on the Suzuki motor and what would I need to do to bring i9t up to spec or stock TL 1000 motor.

Did they only change the Intake system or is there other things like Cams or Valves that were also changed from the TL 1000 motor?

Thanks in advance
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by snapdragon »

Errrrm - :|

not a clue! sorry Jakes - maybe someone will but it's not a problem I've heard about before.
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shebee
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by shebee »

What the specific changes are I'm not sure, but there is one hell of a difference beween the engine in t'other halfs DL1000 (Vstrom) and the Raptor.. He bought the DL cos he liked the Raptor engine... very dissapointed man ! (in fact we keep having discussions about buying a "spare" raptor and using the engine in the DL :oops: )
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by weirdo »

I believe from the books and mags i have that there are no internal engine changes from the TL1000S to the Raptor.

In one book it states that the large quoted power differences between the two are due to the fact Suzuki gave the crank figure (123ps) and Cagiva gave the back wheel figure (104ps).

Raps are actually slightly down on power against the TLS, but it's due to fuel system, mapping and exhaust mods to make the Raptor less aggressive and more "user friendly"
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Dodge
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by Dodge »

Not sure of all the differences between the two, but one problem you will come across is that the TLR engine runs two injectors per cylinder as opposed to the TLS and Raptor engine having only one per cylinder. This means you would have to fit the TLR ecu plus any additional wiring at least :(

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AZ
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by AZ »

TLR has titanium con rods and forged pistons with a higher comp ratio and also different cams to go with extra injection system and an bigger capacity ecu to make the engine run to higher revs and produce the power differently and pushing the torque further up the rev range.There`s probably more differences than that but i can`t remember.
NOTE; bikes do not have air brakes,lofting the front wheel will have an effect on a bikes braking efficiency.
dont arf get the adrenalin pumpin tho!!!
JakesS
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by JakesS »

Ok so I replaced the TPS sensor and the rap is running again.......

So next issue the bike used to get funny when going to about 7000 rpm and it would feel the as if there is nomore power to give? So this weekend wanted to take it fo a spin but the battary was not fully charged so had to push start the bloody thing..... then once it was started I put the tps in the correct position where it is nicely in the middle of the 00. Somthing like this -00 is this correct? Cuz I took the bike to the garage to get the rear wheel some more air as it was slightly deflated. The bike died and had to push start again... (battary is fooked as it doesnt want to charge) I got furios and decided that either ME or the Raptor will break today as it is starting to become a bloody problem that is keeping me from riding. So I race the crap out of it (or tried for that matter) but realised the motor wont rev higher than 8000Rpm. :angry: ...

Now I have never tried or wanted to take it over that as I was concerned for the motor as it is a secondhand bike so I dont know the exact state of the engine. Anyway I spoke to a mate of mine and he reckoned hes TL revs 10000 rpm. I went and looked around and according to what I could find the Raptor is also supposed to be able to reach this rev range somwhere between 9500 to 10000 and if that is the case I am waaaaaay down on power as I cant reach high rpm.

Also had another issue appear this morning ( yes ANOTHER bloody issue!) came up with the FI error stoped pulled the plug and jumped the connection to get the code. C22 in the manual its the Barrometric pressure sensor.

So could the barrow metric presure sensor stop me from getting to 10 000rpm?

O and another thing I found out this weekend is that my Raptor has straight pipes the "stock" canisters are on but there is nothing in them.... Is this a good thing or a bad thing or does it no matter? Could it hamper my performance?

Thanks in advance.
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dizzyblonde
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by dizzyblonde »

Firstly, the pipes shouldn't make a difference.
Secondly, if the battery is always failing......buy another one.

If buying a new battery carries on failing, perhaps, and maybe something in the charging system is causing the issue. I have had a previous Raptor give out FI errors and konk out places, backfire and do a whole manner of things, its been carefully looked over, HT leads replaced, other things, throttle bodies balanced........and all it was in the end, was the battery needed replacing.

There is a common fault with the SVs batteries failing and that is the reg/rec is boogered, I've had one or two do this. It 'might' be possible, that your raptor could have this problem. I'm no expert, so someone with more knowledge might be able to add to this.

Thirdly....why the hell would you want to be revving the kknackers off your bike....it goes perfectly well at around 6k....but not around 3k ,as it bounces around like a kangaroo :pinch: well mine does. Trying to purposely redline the thing, might cause it more damage if its feeling ill.
Is there a possibility that a previous owner has restricted it for some reason....ie 33bhp, for new riders(we have this in the UK)?
Just a thought, but with a restriction, it wouldn't rev past a certain level, no matter how you tried. Again....just a suggestion for cause.
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JakesS
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by JakesS »

Thanks Dizzy but if they hqad fitted a restrictor where would they have fitted it and how would I remove it if they did?

The thing is I like riding fast when I sold my zx9 and bought the raptor I thought I would keep up with them. BIG MISTAKE Kawasaki ZX6's stay with me or I stay with them to be honest and If we get on a highway they are gone I cant catch them! :angry:

In all Honesty the Cagiva Raptor 1000 Is one of the most eye catching bikes I have rode BUT it is also one of the slowest bike's these things are high performance bricks the look the part but dont ever think it would go quick.... :angry:

I am at wits end I have spent ALOT of money buying the bike I have spent almost as much to keep it running and the parts fail one after another. I cant take it anymore! Its slow unreliable and so full of S(&* that I want to set the thing on fire! If I knew this thing was going to give me so much crap I would of forked out the extra money and bought the Fireblade I wanted in the first place. :rant:

I hate this F*(&^( bike......
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by weirdo »

JakesS wrote:55 years agoThe thing is I like riding fast when I sold my zx9 and bought the raptor I thought I would keep up with them. BIG MISTAKE Kawasaki ZX6's stay with me or I stay with them to be honest and If we get on a highway they are gone I cant catch them! :angry:



I am at wits end I have spent ALOT of money buying the bike I have spent almost as much to keep it running and the parts fail one after another. I cant take it anymore! Its slow unreliable and so full of S(&* that I want to set the thing on fire! If I knew this thing was going to give me so much crap I would of forked out the extra money and bought the Fireblade I wanted in the first place. :rant:

I hate this F*(&^( bike......



If the bike you really wanted was a 'blade, and you got rid of a ZX9 to get it, there's no way your Rap will ever reach your expectations. It doesn't matter what you do to it.
I don't recall any of the magazines running comparison tests with blades, gixxer thous, BMW 1000RRs, ZX10sand, er... Raptors :lol:
The best thing for you is to get her running right and get rid, 'cos you'll never be happy with her.
To a Raptor....EVERYTHING else is just prey !!

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JakesS
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by JakesS »

Trust me IF I sell it I will lose money like it or not but I am stuck with the bloody thing. I knew I would not be able to keep up with the 1000cc IL4's on highways but I thought I would atleast be able to race them in the twisties but I cant and I cant figure out why it wont go over 8000rpm.

Can anybody tell me where the bike limits when they change gears at top RPM?
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dizzyblonde
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by dizzyblonde »

I think the problem you have is perhaps you are trying to ride your twin, like an IL4. it will never work.


My OH usually rides a ZZR1400, I've been on the VRap, blinked and seen him as a dot on the horizon, I wouldn't even make an attempt to keep up!
He can make my Raptor flop into corners where I dare not, he regularly takes out my SV and takes the pi$$ out of people on ZX9s and the like(hes overtaken them on roundabouts on the Rap), so perhaps blaming the bike is perhaps a little wrong....poor thing :wavesad:

A friend of mine has a Triumph 995i, its a rather quick little thing, he gave it to my OH to take for a spin, he said it was flickable and you could have some massive grins on it.....however, in third gear my VRap could out accelerate it any day of the week :revrev: BUT.... was no contest for the 955i in different gears etc.


Get your Rap fixed up to work right :ride: , then see if its still as lame as you think now :happyhappy:

I think, if it was restricted(which seems somewhat unlikely) it would be done with an ECU being fuel injected, but I really wouldn't have a clue about it tbh. It sounds like it needs to breath, and get some air in its lungs.......has it had a new air filter?
Yellow 2001 SV650s,2002 VRaptor
Your Rapter looks like a sci fi robot dragon! and it breaths fire too! It singed my eye brows and boiled my eyes at the lights! smudge
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vassilis67
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by vassilis67 »

Take the bike to a professional....set it right and decide what you want from it. But be certain it works properly.
It's all greek to me....
AZ
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by AZ »

For a start ,if the battery is suspect it will not rev out as the charging system will draw the power before the ecu and at high revs when the fuel pump, ecu and coils etc need more juice then they wont get it and it`ll feel a bag of sh*t,mine did.After fitting a new battery it was like a new bike.Also make sure you have top quality plugs fitted ,i fitted new bog standard ngk plugs and it was crap.After fitting some irridium plugs it went like the clappers and was better on fuel as well.Up the top end(over 100) my bike wont keep up with modern sports 1000`s but every where else it eats them,well once i`d sussed out how to launch from a standstill without trying to flip it all the time.These bikes are about going underneath and around the other bikes and using the drive out of corners to make sure you stay ahead.A while back i wasted a guy on a Ducati 916 who was supposed to be a fast rider,it`s all about how you get on with the bike and if you ride it like an in line 4 then you`ll hate it.You need to change your riding style to suit the bike and once you`ve figured out how they like to be ridden then you`ll never go back to an IL4 ,I wont and before the raptor all i had was IL4`s.
NOTE; bikes do not have air brakes,lofting the front wheel will have an effect on a bikes braking efficiency.
dont arf get the adrenalin pumpin tho!!!
JakesS
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Re: Motor difference between Raptor 1000 and TL 1000 motor?

Post by JakesS »

The issue is not my riding style I thought it might be. I can not keep up with anyone I know in a mountain pass and thats it no matter how hard I try. The f*&&_)(* thing bogs below 3000rpm entering a slow corner and wont go over 8000rpm in ANY gear and then the inline's just pass me and pull away! :shock:

I changed the battary yesterday afternoon and guess what....... NO CHANGE!!!! I looked at plugs..... according to the manual it must run on NGK RC8K's and that is what it has in and looks good but changed them anyway I put in NGK RC9K's thought the higher one would work better...... Nope it doesn't...... :doh:

Its almost as if it wants to run out of gas when you reach 7000 and then takes 3 seconds to go from 7000 to 8000 rpm 3 SECONDS!!! (I counted last night.)
:pinch:
I cleaned the filter and injectors last night had the bloody things parts laying around everywhere checked ALL the connections everything was working fine..... :thumbsup:

So now I ask again WHAT RPM SHOULD THE RAPTOR BE ABLE TO REV? CAN ANYONE PLEASE ANSWER THIS.... :rant:

Your saying do this and ched that but you still have not answered my question of what RPM I could rev too? :suspect:
When in doubt...... FLAT OUT!!!
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